Dalrock just went down for a vacation. One last commenter requested some red-pill for the website Patheos. Why not? Sounds more like my cup of tea anyway. This one should be fun for the whole Christian family!
Paganism, Catholicism and the Amazonian Synod
By RENÉ ALBERT, 12 October 2019
As someone who has spent a significant amount of time in the Evangelical community, it isn’t uncommon to hear flippant comments about Catholicism. Often the main points of contention between Protestants and Catholics are the role of Mary, the meaning of the Eucharist, the means of justification through faith and/versus works and interpretation of Scripture to name a handful. Though an argument that is often brought up by Evangelicals is the notion that the Catholic Church is inherently pagan.
Paganism is not a point of contention between Prots and Cats. Scripture vs Tradition, yes, maybe idolatry vs anarchy, but neither side can legitimately be called Pagan.
The word ‘pagan’ often makes Christians (especially Catholics) put their guard up. But a common talking point among certain Protestants is that the Catholic Church was created by Emperor Constantine in the 4th century. Of course, this is laughably false; but his dramatic conversion from paganism did lead to Christianity becoming the official religion of the Roman Empire. Many fundamentalists would claim that this is the reason why images of the Virgin Mary and the saints are reminiscent of ancient pagan gods.
Which leads me to ask, what’s so bad about paganism?
That is not a question any Christian should be asking. Paganism, like every religion except Christianity, is a false religion. There is one God and all claims to the contrary are either ignorance or treachery.
Rene’s attempt to deflect criticism of paganism to criticism of Catholicism is therefore suspicious conduct. The most firebrand Evangelical can still see the difference between Catholicism and rain dances.
[Wikipedia’s definition of paganism omitted]
In spite of the word originally being derogatory…
It was originally descriptive, from the Latin word paganus referring to rural people, who tended to worship nature without the hindrance of formal education. Most organized (in the city) religions, of which the Roman Empire had many, came to have little respect for the ignorant religious practices of their redneck bumpkins. Legalized Christianity inherited that disrespect and I’m happy to keep the tradition alive.
Go howl at the moon again, ye ignorant savages! (Lifts kilt.)
…it seems like many modern polytheists embrace the word like a badge of honor (at least in my observation).
Most polytheists being literal pagans, why not. The non-pagan polytheists, example Hindus, might have some words and sticks to share with you.
But it appears the most obvious thing that separates Christianity from the various forms of paganism is between the number of deities they worship. Christians, Jews and Muslims believe in one true God and that their faith descends from Abraham. Christians believe God exists in three persons: the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit (also known as the Trinity). The Trinity is often mistaken as three separate deities, which is why Jews and Muslims (as monotheistic religions) believe Christianity to be a form of polytheism.
That is fatally wrong. As I said before, the separation between Christianity and everybody else is that we worship the CORRECT God. Not “one god instead of many”. The Muzzies worship only one god, too, yet they’re Satan’s useful idiots.
Polytheism comes in many different forms, though for the sake of staying on the topic of the Amazonian Synod I’m going to focus mainly on North American Indigenous culture. In both Christian and Indigenous religious belief, the Earth is viewed as something to be good stewards of. However, the two differ in how the Earth and nature is revered. Christians view the Earth as a created gift and a temporary home, whereas the Indigenous generally belief is that the Earth is a mother of creation and an ultimate source of life — hence the popular name Mother Earth.
Thus far, Rene’s been playing the entryist/infiltrator strategy by the book. First explain why paganism is more of an insult than a false religion, then point out how the eeeevil Lutherans think all Catholics are that definition of “pagan”, then go into how actual pagans aren’t much different from Christians because we all believe that Starship Earth is our home that must be cared for as a religious duty.
Not a word of truth in all o’ that. Next in the playbook, he’ll say that we Christians have much to learn from God’s enemies.
I think we can certainly learn from our Indigenous neighbors on how to work together to be better stewards of the Earth and the environment.
Ding! Rene Albert, you are a Satanic piece of lying shit the infested the RCC because you couldn’t manage it in Protestant circles. Thank you for the backhanded compliment.
After all, we breathe the same air and drink water from rivers that are connected to others. However, from a theological standpoint, I think one of the biggest sources of contention between Christians and “pagan” culture is whether they worship the Creator or the created. As Christians, we ought to value our planet as a gift from God, but we certainly don’t worship the Earth.
The standard talking point of Globalists. “Your religion says you need to care about Climate Change!” Well no, it doesn’t. That isn’t what God said. He promised to destroy this reality when He was done with it, therefore there’s no argument to be made for our preserving it on His behalf.
Atheists got no authority to tell us Christians what our religion teaches… ESPECIALLY if they worm into our clergy first. That just pre-judges them as treacherous liars.
That being said, I think one of the reasons why there is so much apprehension from the Eurocentric Christian worldview is because race and culture are often assumed to be correlated with religion, even in cases where they shouldn’t be. For example, white people in North America are generally assumed to be of European descent, which many would assume come from some form of Christian tradition. But nowadays, that isn’t always the case since our modern society is becoming more non-religious. This is one of the reasons why I think culture and personal belief shouldn’t be viewed as one and the same.
You little shitbag, Rene. Suspicion of “what pagans have to teach us Christians” is hardly a “Eurocentric” perspective. Culture is the aggregate of personal beliefs, unless you take the position of letting people worship whatever deity they want so long as they also worship Caesar.
And don’t spike that “white men are no longer Christian” football too hard. We didn’t abandon God just because you termites successfully infiltrated our seminaries and legislatures. Heck, this won’t even be the first time that Christianity has found itself on the wrong side of the ascendant World Religion. Especially in that “Eurocentric” tradition you sneer at.
Case in point: I’m a French Canadian who was raised in the Roman rite of the Catholic Christian faith, though I didn’t always call myself Catholic. There was a 12-year period in my life when I considered myself to be an Evangelical Protestant. But during that time, I still valued my French heritage. I still partook in my hometown’s Fête au Village every year. I still had tourtière every Christmas dinner. But now that I’ve reverted to Catholicism, I’ve rediscovered a sense of my own identity through attending the Tridentine Latin Mass. This is the same Mass that my own parents attended when they were young; and the Mass my grandparents grew up with as well as their own parents before them, and so forth.
The better liars try to establish rapport with their dupes before passing out the insults, Rene.
What comes to mind is when the early European explorers migrated to North America and shared land and culture with the Indigenous people. As more Europeans settled in North America, tensions between cultures became more commonplace. One of the reasons why the residential schools were so controversial was because of the methods of coercion used to forcefully convert Indigenous children to Christianity. For them, this meant adopting a religion that took on a westernized, Romanesque imagery rather than something that was resonant with their culture.
Oh, those horrible, evil, Eurocentric white cis-men, ruining the peaceful cultures of Stone Age primitives who have so much to teach us, like cannibalism. (And cannibalism is, in fact, resurging as a globalist priority.) Scum like Rene won’t listen to anything I have to say so let’s segue to a local expert. Here’s a name you won’t see anywhere in the mainstream media, not even the likes of Fox News: Jonas Marcolino de Souza Macuxí. Segue:
10 September 2019
[translated from Spanish]
I, as indigenous leader Macuxí and one of the directors of the North Roraima Indigenous Defense Association, stated that until the age of eighteen I devoted myself exclusively to hunting and fishing. I was born to illiterate parents, I became a mathematics teacher and I graduated in Law. My people and I are totally opposed to the demarcation of our Reserve.
We are integrated, we use electricity, cars, buses and we have productive villages. We want to access these tools, we want to progress. The problem is that some believe that in the 21st century there are still people who can survive by hunting and fishing. FUNAI ( Fundação Nacional do Indio ) prohibits access to development. This policy condemns us to live in a primitive past. …
Some indigenous peoples have lived in the Americas long before the Portuguese and other Old World nations arrived. There they lived and fought, some died out and others emigrated.
Over the centuries in the Amazon a bit of everything has arrived: explorers, adventurers, pirates, missionaries, naturalists, botanists, zoologists, ethnologists, anthropologists and scientists. Many were the scholars who saw the opportunity and the possibility of offering a new lifestyle to the natives.
All this process of encounters with different cultures has actually allowed an interchange and a partial fusion with different traditions, behaviors and feelings with respect to the indigenous identity. The same story was shared. It was a natural and non-imposed process.
Unfortunately, the fruitful fruit of this process of cultural interchange was poisoned by missionaries of the so-called Liberation Theology, by some members of environmental and environmentalist movements, as well as by some NGOs, which under the pretext of protecting the poor indigenous have actually collected large sums of money, more for their own interests and for their financiers than for the natives of the Amazon. The external influences have been very many indeed.
It is from the mid-twentieth century that many supporters of the Indians, the so-called “indigenists”, religious and civilians, politicians and NGOs, both national and international, enter the scene. They followed the indigenist ideal inspired by a new conception of the Catholic Church, prophetically denounced in the work of Plinio Corrêa de Oliveira of 1977 “Indigenous tribalism, communist-missionary ideal for Brazil in the XXI century” .
These new missionaries worked hard to realize the false ideal described by Professor Pliny. They wanted to go back in history, taking the aboriginal as an ideal model. They wanted to destroy, dismantle, defame, separate and fight. The exact opposite of what we wanted.
Remember that the works of the devil are to kill, steal and destroy.
We natives by no means intend to go back to the past. We want to enjoy all the fundamental freedoms and rights, inalienable and indispensable to guarantee full human dignity. Thousands of natives are already fully integrated into universal civilization, no longer living in the stone age and not practicing cannibalism. The very few tribes that still practice infanticide in Brazil do so because the law allows it, considering this barbaric practice an expression of a cultural tradition, in total disregard of the inviolable right to life, freedom, security and dignity.
Many practices among the natives in the Amazon, such as walking long distances, carrying cassava in a backpack, or loading logs on the shoulders or straw on the head, are necessary for survival and not for tradition or cultural value.
Yeah, that never did sound like fun.
In 1949 the Mission of São José, the Hospital of São Camilo and the School of Father José de Anchieta were established, where the missionaries of the Consolata Mission mainly worked, starting a new phase in the history of the indigenous peoples of the state of Roraima.
José de Anchieta is a known Jesuit. That faction practices much evil, specifically Liberation Theology:
This mission had begun well, but later, with the arrival of the new missionaries of Liberation Theology, these same structures – Mission, Hospital and School – were used to implement an opposite policy: that of dismantling the local economy, which is based on cattle breeding, rice culture and subsistence farming.
This dismantling process culminated with the closure of farms in the 1990s and the end of rice cultivation in 2005, following the unfortunate demarcation of the Raposa Serra do Sol reserve.
It is interesting to note that at that time the Indians were already integrated, an integration that had its peak with the prestigious presence of Marshal Cândido Rondon in the indigenous Macuxí villages of the state of Roraima. Rondon was a unique hero. After his death, his figure inspired universities, professionals, academics, army and navy in the creation of the Rondon Project, which led university students to learn about the Brazilian reality and to participate in the development process of these distant regions. This institution became permanent in June 1968, at the time of the military government, with the motto: “Integrating, not delivering”, which replaced the first “The jungle is not our enemy”.
We now see the influence of new religious missions and NGOs.
The Consolata missionaries arrived in the territory of Rio Branco in 1948 to continue the mission begun by the Benedictines which was intended to catechize the Indians.
In the 1970s, however, the new missionaries connected with the Theology of Liberation arrived and the change began, with clearly negative effects.
I give an example. The fazendeiros [GQ: farmers] made a great effort to help and grow the São José Mission, donating 100, 200 and even 300 oxen to the Mission each year. They never imagined that the new missionary priests, whom they also treated with the utmost respect and affection, would use these resources to expel them from the region.
Even the commandments of God’s law were overthrown.
Edmilson das Neves, popularly known as Nêgo da Guanabara, states that in 1971 [Father Jorge Álvarez Calderón, a Jesuit] celebrated his marriage in the indigenous community of Contão. At the time, Father Jorge preached the word of God and spoke of the Ten Commandments, including “Don’t steal”. Already in the mid-1980s, when Edmilson again met this priest in the Canta Galo community, he asked him why he had changed his preaching, inducing the natives to steal the cattle from the fazendeiros , contradicting what he himself preached before. Father Jorge replied: “There are many types of theft. Stolen out of necessity, because someone is a kleptomaniac and so on … ” Edmilson concludes: ” Father Jorge spoke and talked until he almost convinced me that stealing is right “.
In addition to the preaching of theft, there is also suspicion of treason and murder.
The Grandmother Monica, an elderly woman from the Camararém community, tells for example that Father Jorge Dalden coming to Maturuca asked permission to live there. The Tuxaua Lauro Merikior, in a gesture of humanity, welcomed him. After a few months, the priest disappeared from the community, taking the young Jaci with him. When they returned, the Tuxaua Lauro died suddenly. For Nonna Monica it was Father Jorge who had the Tuxaua Lauro Merikior killed, to allow Jaci to take charge and thus achieve his purpose in the region. Lauro Merikior had inherited the chief’s staff from his father Meriquior, who had received it from Marshal Rondon.
I could tell many facts of this kind. These religious propagate liberation theology under the aegis of communism, and vice versa. In three decades, they succeeded in nullifying everything that had been built in the state of Roraima in more than a century. A century of prosperity based on economic freedom, private property and the principles of the capitalist economy, with an emphasis on the principle of freedom in work. In a short time everything was destroyed in the name of a revolutionary primitivism.
There’s much more at the link. I’m convinced that one reason Pope Frankie is holding his Convergence Synod in the Amazon is to spike the football where his faction, the Jesuits, successfully tore South America apart into civil war for half the 20th Century. It was one of their greatest accomplishments to date, apparently, and now it’s time for Liberation Theology to be applied globally.
Suck on that egg, Rene Albert.
When it comes to Christians evangelizing to other parts of the world, one of the barriers they face is cultural differences. The Jesuits were especially good at using descriptions of God that resonated with the tribes, such as ‘The Great Spirit.‘ Even Christian iconography, an evangelizing tool that was used to communicate stories, was done in the form of Indigenous art in order to share stories from the Bible. Catholic Christianity blended immensely well with the aesthetics of Indigenous tribes with their respect and love for our Creator and nature.
Heh, heh. I didn’t intentionally time Rene’s endorsement of Jesuit behavior towards the locals but am pleased regardless. Per the Playbook of Evil, Rene is required to reveal who he really is despite it not being in his best interest to do so. God is not “the Great Spirit”. Even the Holy Spirit is not some nebulous “Great Spirit”, it’s the Spirit of Christ.
Unfortunately, as far as colonialism is concerned, the negatives tend to overshadow the positives. And the best way to deal with the negatives is to look them straight in their ugly faces.
I think the thought of losing a religious or cultural identity resonates with many conservative Christians, especially when we consider persecution for our faith.
Religion is not a synonym for culture. I’ll die for Christ but not a cheeseburger.
If you don’t want your own cultural heritage to be suppressed and wiped out of existence, why would you wish that upon someone else?
Because they want what we have to offer. Stop trying to cause division between people who have different cultures, you Jesuit!
This calls back to the passage in the Bible about doing unto others as they would do unto you (Matthew 7:12, Luke 6:31). This is one of the reasons why when Native Americans are told to ‘just get over it’ by white people, it cuts deep to the core of their existence. It minimizes the experiences of hardship these people and their families continue to endure to this very day. It would be like someone telling a Jewish person to just get over the Holocaust.
More attempts to cause division.
This is what makes the Amazonian Synod at the Vatican so significant. It’s a historically pivotal event where the Church is attempting to reconcile with the Indigenous population of the Pan-Amazon nations for the collective sins of individuals who exploited the land, the resources and the people who live there – thus creating the socioeconomic climate they are left to deal with.
The Church isn’t even reconciling with the Church, now that the Synod wants to lift a millenium-old ban on married clergy. Let alone repair the damage done to the natives by JESUITS SUCH AS THE POPE HIMSELF.
Unfortunately, the positive intentions of the Synod have been drowned out by vocal groups who fear the Church changing disciplines regarding clerical celibacy across the board and being unequally yoked with pagan rituals.
Antifa? Is that you? You aren’t wearing urban camo today.
One of the sources of outrage came from images shared on social media of a tree-planting ceremony involving a carving that was mistaken for the goddess of fertility (which was believed to be an Indigenous artistic depiction of the Blessed Virgin Mary). Conveniently enough, the image also appeared to be bare-breasted, which I understand may be taboo in North American purity culture, but certainly does not phase a South American native. There have been many Romanesque depictions of Mary nursing the infant Jesus. Ironically enough, the Tilma of Guadalupe, one of the most iconic images in Catholic culture, happens to depict the Virgin Mary using ancient Aztec imagery.
That’s a total lie. Destroying those fertility idols were a beautiful act of trolling the crypto-Pagans wearing Catholic masks. Does the term “graven image” mean nothing to Rene?
While I can understand the reasoning behind the apprehension surrounding the Amazonian Synod, I think much of it is rooted in a fear of the unknown.
Oh no, not “the unknown”. We Christians fear that the Amazon Synod is exactly what it looks like: the enemies of God throwing a combination victory party and Vatican III to enshrine their globalist Convergence under the perennial fraud of Climate Change, using noble Commie savages for political props and rhetorical human shields. Is there any disgrace you Liberation Theology pigs won’t wallow in?
Anything new or unfamiliar is terrifying; and for many Catholics, this Synod is uncharted territory. I think it’s worth pondering whether or not the hype over ‘pagan idolatry’ is a modern manifestation of deep-seated prejudice thinly veiled as righteous outrage.
This is a DARVO. Deny, Attack, Reverse Victim and Offender.
This certainly does not mean we ought to dismiss the possibility of blurring the lines between Earth-stewardship and Earth-worship, let alone a relativistic approach to Church discipline. But I think if Roman-rite Catholics can get away with consecrating pagan objects into Christianity, I don’t see why the Amazonian Catholics couldn’t experience the same with their own culture as long as it brings glory and honor to Christ.
More true than he wants us to realize. “if Roman-rite Catholics can get away with consecrating pagan objects into Christianity, I don’t see why the Amazonian Catholics couldn’t experience the same with their own culture”, heh. That’s exactly why trashing those pagan idols is significant behavior. We do not respect the idols of unbelievers. That way lies Unity.
Or should we say, Convergence.